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Annoying things in Webcomics
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Meggyc



Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Posts: 253

PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ryan.noriega wrote:

enshogirl wrote:
ryan.noriega wrote:
I kind of hate comics whose characters are just people. There's only so much you can do, and it just becomes generic. It's a cartoon, which means anything can happen.


Haha, what? If someone can't make a comic about just people interesting, then something's wrong. I don't think you necessarily need a talking hamster to move a story along.

If it's a cartoon, as you say, you can do ANYTHING with a human cast as well. I don't know why you'd have to limit them to reality in the way they look or act.


I agree with you there, but the rest of what I said was about the premise, and I think it goes along with what Hyena Hell said. What I was hinting at are the comics that are basically about the author and his friends, whose dinnertime conversations must be so much more interesting then my own. And if you disagree, that's fine. Those comics just don't draw [b[my[/b] attention.


Comics can be about anything or anyone and still be interesting. One could write a realistic comic about a man who digs ditches and it may be a masterpiece. Likewise, it's possible to create a comic featuring Kandinsky-styled abstract images and it can be outstanding, as long as the writing is good.

One would be hard pressed to find something worse than reading a poorly drawn, poorly written comic about what a self-absorbed fourteen year old accomplished today on Warcraft, but that's not to say there aren't some good gamer comics out there... Or that there aren't some wonderful journal comics out there.

I think it's great that a person can make a comic about whatever they want to. There are good comics that are based in reality, just as there are good comics that feature cartoony characters and situations. (Just as there are bad comics of either genre.)
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jpcline



Joined: 24 Mar 2009
Posts: 291

PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Casual Notice wrote:
jpcline wrote:
anezka wrote:


I want to reiterate grammar and add spelling (to the list).


LOL irony

Corrected for the context-impaired.


Embarassed
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munkymu
Postpostpostpostpost!


Joined: 30 Nov 1999
Posts: 1735
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mooncity wrote:

Penny Arcage ripoffs. Extra HATE points when said comic has clones of Gabe & Tycho thinly disguised with different colored hair/shirts or slightly different shaped heads.


Ooh, yeah, I hate that too. Not just Penny Arcade, either, but any comic where you can just look at the bloody thing and say "what, do you think we've never *heard* of Calvin and Hobbes/Ozy and Mille/Sailor Moon/Elfquest/ or whatever thing you're ripping off here?" I mean, there's "I liked this comic's style so you can see it's one of my influences" and then there's "do you like my comic, Kevin and Flobbes? It's about a boy and his stuffed cheetah. I have done nothing but trace Bill Watterson's art for three years, but I will deny it to my last breath if you ask."
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Hyena Hell



Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 38

PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ryan.noriega wrote:
Hyena Hell wrote:


1. Autobio comics described as "Whatever random stuff that pops into my head". (Usually the next sentence is "Updated whenever I feel like it.")



Aren't all comics based on random stuff that pops into folks's heads? I question that logic for obvious reasons (that's what my comic is).


I'm more specifically talking about the way in which people describe their comic than I am the actual comic.

To me, that reads: "I can't think of a good story or premise for a comic, so I'll make it about me and my friends! And if I say it's "random", I don't have to develop a individual voice or means of conveying my humor/point that stands out from anything else!" And it makes me think that comic is probably an inconsistent and unintelligible mess of the author's weak attempts to make his/her exploits seem interesting, regurgitated pop culture references, and un-clever Seinfeildian tangents.

That doesn't mean that's what the comic is, that's just what I imagine when I read that particular description (which I've seen appear, verbatim, so many times I can't even be bothered to guess at the number). Shocked
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ryan.noriega
Plan Eleven


Joined: 21 Mar 2009
Posts: 336
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hyenahell, it looks like we're hating the same thing...

But another random thing that just popped into my head: If a comic advertises itself as "really funny," and the first comic I see doesn't make me laugh, I never look at that comic again.

It's a really terrible thing to say, cuz a lot of my own are really hit or miss, and I imagine there are a lot of people who click my banner, see a pig tied to a surfboard and then decide it would be best to block all images from my website. But there's just so many webcomics to read; it's that sort of thing that matters when it comes to gaining readers.

I've clicked every banner that's come up in this forum, and I either go click>add to favorites or click>bye. With so many options, I, and many other people don't have times for maybes. (Although I do click back sometimes.)

Also, if someone sees something in this forum that seems to be directed at them, I wouldn't take it too personally. Just because one or a lot of people hate something you do, that doesn't apply to everyone.

But you should at least try to defend yourself. Cuz that makes it fun.
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jynksie



Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 612
Location: New Hampshire USA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think I saw this one on the list, but I'll throw it out there.

The thing that rubs me wrong is when a comic artist creates a new comic, has a small archive, promotes the hell out of it, gets upset with the low numbers and dumps it. If you are doing a comic, you -should- be doing it because you are passionate about the concept you've created and it's something your willing to nurture and grow over time.

There Isn't a comic out there that became a success overnight, it takes years to establish your comic and it takes just as long to build a sizeable readership. If you are in it for the popularity contest and the instant gratification, well, it makes me want to bitch slap you... hard! Shocked

I'll draw my comic until I have nothing left for them to say, whether during that time I get thousands or hundreds or even mere dozens... I sincerely live by the credo "A cartoonist draws for himself and hopes others like it".
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Taran



Joined: 04 Mar 2009
Posts: 70
Location: Denver

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't see anybody mention
stick figures!!!
Wait, shit... that's me...
Seriously though, I do think using stick figures is not as good as using... you know, fully drawn people.
But me and my brother have been drawing Bob Comics for like 10+ years, so I'm pretty much locked into the whole stick figure thing by now.
Furthermore, being funny and/or interesting is more important than the art, in my opinion. Must I mention XKCD?
(Also, Sarah Zero makes me cower in shame at my skills-of-an-artist)

Most of the stuff I dislike about webcomics has been mentioned already. (And now I'm feeling ridiculously egotistical because my comic avoids just about all of them! Wooo!)

Overuse of copy/paste is definitely something I hate.
Notable exceptions include: "Dinosaur comics"


Here's something else I've gotten sick of seeing - the standard newspaper version of comic humor:
One character on stage left, another on stage right, the setting unimportant, they exchange dialogue... And then every single comic looks exactly like that ... just, ugh. UGH!


Quote:
When the navigation buttons aren't on the top and bottom of the comic. (If I want to skip through comics, I need the top buttons; if I'm reading the comic and I want to go to the next page, I don't want to go all the way up past the comic again to the top button, so I want a bottom button too.)


That's a good one. I wonder if we should do that for our comic? Although, I do mine in episodes, so it's a bit different than if you just have one long string of comics...
I dunno. Do you guys think there should be navigation buttons on the top of my comics? I'm always looking for ways to improve the website.
http://www.bobcomics.net/comics/e5/title.shtml

Oh, and does anybody think it would be a good idea to have it where if you click on the comic image itself, it goes to the next page? That's how Facebook does it. This seems like it could be annoying or convenient. I'm not sure which.
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dailywisdom



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 93
Location: Oklahoma City, OK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taran wrote:
I didn't see anybody mention
stick figures!!!
Wait, shit... that's me...


Stick figures can be awesome. They can also be very, very bad.

Taran wrote:

Oh, and does anybody think it would be a good idea to have it where if you click on the comic image itself, it goes to the next page? That's how Facebook does it. This seems like it could be annoying or convenient. I'm not sure which.


That seems to be a common convention for photo albums. Personally, I prefer the "click on this for a higher resolution version" alternative.

I ended up doing the next link in my extras gallery when you click on the picture (as well as regular navigation buttons), just because people would expect it, but I probably will never do that to the main comic.

Also, since your comic requires a vertical scroll, navigation above AND below isn't a bad idea.
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munkymu
Postpostpostpostpost!


Joined: 30 Nov 1999
Posts: 1735
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taran wrote:

Oh, and does anybody think it would be a good idea to have it where if you click on the comic image itself, it goes to the next page? That's how Facebook does it. This seems like it could be annoying or convenient. I'm not sure which.


Yes. Do this. As long as there are also buttons for people who like buttons, it makes my sad wrists SO MUCH HAPPIER if I can click anywhere on the comic instead of scrolling around playing hunt-the-button.
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Varethane



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 556

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

munkymu wrote:
Oh, and does anybody think it would be a good idea to have it where if you click on the comic image itself, it goes to the next page? That's how Facebook does it. This seems like it could be annoying or convenient. I'm not sure which.
My vote is for convenient! I can think of a few webcomics that do this, and I have to say, it's really easy to get used to it. After reading one I have this tendency to move on to other comics, try to click on the pages, and be disappointed when it doesn't work. I'd do it myself if I had a CMS up and running already... (sorry Kez I swear I'm working on it!)
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dailywisdom



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 93
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

munkymu wrote:
Yes. Do this. As long as there are also buttons for people who like buttons, it makes my sad wrists SO MUCH HAPPIER if I can click anywhere on the comic instead of scrolling around playing hunt-the-button.


Why'd you have to offer a compelling reason for me to do more work?

EDIT: And then I took 10 minutes of time and added it to both my strips. I never thought of the anti-carpal-tunnel angle.
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Kallisti



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 709
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I started another thread about this a couple months ago here: http://www.thewebcomiclist.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=76978

It delves from the purely technical into the vague and disturbing pretty quickly, including not one but two rants involving Comic Sans and attacking the ad-bait-and-switch issue.
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max1975



Joined: 15 May 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taran wrote:
I didn't see anybody mention
stick figures!!!
Wait, shit... that's me...
Seriously though, I do think using stick figures is not as good as using... you know, fully drawn people.
But me and my brother have been drawing Bob Comics for like 10+ years, so I'm pretty much locked into the whole stick figure thing by now.
Furthermore, being funny and/or interesting is more important than the art, in my opinion. Must I mention XKCD?


I used to agree that being funny or interesting was more important than art, and because I draw but don't write my comic, this made me feel kind of superfluous. But more and more, when I try to find new webcomics to read, I find that unprofessional art is an instant turnoff. You can draw fully rendered anatomically correct demigods, or you can draw stick figures (that one in your avatar is pretty cool, btw)...but if you don't actually know how to draw it, I'm just gonna close the window.

I was reading through this list and thinking, "Hey, my comic's doing great!" until I got to the one about pirates and ninjas and looked back at my site and saw our current storyline is called "Ninjas vs. Pirates" Smile

One thing I don't think I've seen mentioned--webcomics that aren't funny. By this I mean webcomics that aren't intended to be funny. I just think it's the wrong format for serious life & death drama. The exception might be if the comic is completed and published in its entirety. But if I have to read it a page at a time with days or weeks in between, my head just can't get into that space without the payoff of a cheap laugh or at least some amusement.

-max
Cosmic Hellcat Adventures
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Miluette



Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Posts: 679
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ohh, I love this thread and the one just linked. In fact I added the linked one to my bookmarks; thanks Kallisti.

I had a few small peeves I was about to post and then completely forgot them. I think it's because somebody already mentioned my major ones.

I guess I'll say this... subtlety in advertising is really appreciated. Big boldness is only best when you're making a claim you have actually already fulfilled, or are making none at all (simply presenting the product, which I prefer). Instead of original taglines, people like to say "wacky catgirls!" or "the funniest webcomic ever", and I don't know who they expect to believe them/care.
People crap all over their descriptions, too. I need everybody describing their work to think one thing before they hit "submit" on their new comic listing: what makes that different from anything else? Generic, undescriptive summaries kill me. People need to think back-of-the-movie-box. Everyone reads them; why can't they emulate them?


By the way, re: comic navigation, I have it so that both my comics' archives on the main sites and one of their mirrors have comic image links that move the navigation forward. In my experience it is hella convenient, so I implemented that wherever I could.

It's a nice alternative, I think, to having navigation both above and below the comic, which aesthetically I just don't like. (Aesthetically I like it most when the nav buttons are appropriately on the left and right sides of the comic itself, centered vertically on the page, but I see this rarely done, or done well.)

What do you think about the left and right arrow keys activating left and right in the nav? That really does have a potential to be inconvenient, albeit a small one. I actually don't prefer it as much, though some may.
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Kallisti



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 709
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Senshuu wrote:
Instead of original taglines, people like to say "wacky catgirls!" or "the funniest webcomic ever", and I don't know who they expect to believe them/care.

It's funny you say that.
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